Welcome to the podcast. Come be part of the conversations that happen around my kitchen table. He's John Brannion and he's been a stand up comic for more than 30 years. She's a man to McKinney and she's been my daughter for her whole life. Our family believes laughter is a gift from God. We often discover it while discussing culture, faith and family. So go ahead and pull up a chair neighbor. Can I call you Carl? There's plenty of room here for you. Well, thanks for joining us. Oh, is that? I forgot what I was going to say to start. So I just made a noise and then said welcome. Like one of those weather alerts. Yeah. We had a nice, day, so we threw some discs and now my shoulders killing me. Now there's nothing else to talk about. That's nothing else to talk about. But we had a request from a listener to talk about disc golf. Was it chance? No. Okay. No. Did we even hit the basket today? Hmm. I don't think we did. No. Yeah. Not even a close one. Not even one that was like, oh, oh, oh. Yeah. Yeah. That's the first time out. We talked about disc golf for, you know, we try to accommodate the listeners. And if the public is demanding a mention of disc golf, then it's literally one person. Well, is asking one person. What is the public use? It's up to collection of individuals. I mean, if Jesus will leave the 99 for one, then we will take your ones and just mention disc golf for our one faithful at one a.m. this morning. I got an email from John Brownian about his his comedy, his comedy course, comedy creation 101. It says resume course at one a.m. One 13 a.m. Wow. Yeah. It says I am 85% complete, but I've done the whole thing. I don't know why I'm saying that. I don't, I don't know either. I didn't know. I didn't even know that it was still. It's still that's concerned. It's still throwing it out there. Still throwing it out there. It's still jumping up my inbox. That's the sort of thing that's going to eventually annoy his adoring fans who are in their 70s and 80s. Yeah. It's like, why are you still sending me things? I mean, I could unsubscribe for me, but it's nice to hear from John once in a while. It is nice to hear from my automated robot. Eventually, they'll be like, listen, we love John, but could you please stop waking us up at three a.m. One in the morning, and I'd be, I'll have to tell him, I wish I could. Well, in the process of retooling the out of our hands. Yeah, this is bigger than us. What are you going over tomorrow at the preaching summit? AI stuff. AI stuff. So nothing. Luke hates that. Luke hates that. Luke gets annoyed with us for talking about AI like two or three weeks in a row. And we talked about disc golf every week for the entire spring. None of this is our last year. We mentioned disc golf. We didn't talk extensively about it. It was an appetizer. What if we talk about how to use AI to improve your disc golf game? What if we did that? What do you think? I would be more on board with that. I don't know if you can. I would be more on board with that. He says he doesn't eat it. He's already learned everything he needs to learn about how to perform in every athletic endeavor from here on out. What is it? Share it with Carl. What's the secret? Empty your mind. No, no, let him. You've heard even less than I have. You've just heard my summary of his summary. You have to let him tell you what this new book is about. What I've done is I've heard so much of your input about the book that I don't remember the book anymore. You have erased his recollection of what the book actually said. Again, I've now, like halfway, to the book. Uh-huh. What does that have to do with anything? The book is called The Inner Game of Tennis. It's talking about the mental aspect being the most difficult part of tennis. How many times have you played tennis in your life? Oh, like twice. Twice. Yeah. I didn't even think that was like this. I've played harder than it was. Two times. That's more than I thought. Okay. I've played ping pong more, but I am even worse at that than I am tennis. We have two more. Because it is tennis, but it's smaller and harder. We have access to tennis courts right over there. And so now, when you finish the book, of course, because you have to read the entire thing chapter to cover to cover in order to get all of the goodness out of it. But once you do, theoretically, you should be able to just walk over there and just do whatever is good in tennis. Back to fire out of that bowl. Do good tennis stuff. Well, it's about, it's similar to the things I've already heard, where it's about, you can't try to be creative and be a critic at the same time. Those two things are different parts of the brain and they conflict with each other and you're not going to be very creative if you're also critiquing what you're doing in real time. Yeah. He said it was very, there were overlaps with your comedy courts. I actually agree with that. Yeah. Some people with improv and all sorts of, anybody creative would say that you put the editing hat cap on at a later time, but you've got to be able to not judge the crap that's coming to your brain immediately. Because you've got to get through that to get to the good stuff. And so basically while you are practicing a thing, it's physically like tennis or goal for whatever, you can't be, you can't have that part of your brain trying to control the natural body movements and stuff at the same time. You have to think, this is the outcome that I'd want. I'd like the ball to go here. I'd like it to have this arc and all that. But then you have to let your body do it. You can't be thinking, all right, I got to make sure I get my elbow down and my wrist tight and then I, you can't have all those thoughts while you're also expecting your body to do the thing you'd like it to do. Right. It gets in the way. It comes it up and it makes it a lot harder. So it's basically just about not over thinking stuff and letting your body perform and make adjustments the way that you learned to walk without somebody telling you each individual tiny step to it. Right. You learn to walk by giving up and walking. Yeah. You didn't read a book before you learned to walk either. And so that's a bit of a, a bit of a hang up that I have. Yes, man, he doesn't think the book needs to exist. Well, no, if the point is to stop thinking about it, I feel like that's a bit of a bait and switch. Don't you? If you're trying to get people to stop thinking about the mechanics, but then you're going to turn around and write a book, that is the part of your brain that's not the editor. Or sorry, that's. So reading a book is also not learning to walk. Right. Right. It's more of a, I get the subtle, subtle irony of it. Well, it's also, it's also one of those things that I, I think, and it may just be because I don't, I don't learn this way, but I don't think it's possible to read about how to do physical things and then be able to do those physical things. He talks about that. It's very difficult to, to read a step of instructions and then your body do it. But if you can witness somebody else do it or it helps, but yeah, it's, it's training the body to do a particular motion if we're talking about sports. For example, like bowling is really hard. And there's not that much to it. I mean, if you can, if you can get your approach and your swing to where it's consistent and your release, right. But it has to be a free flowing swing. You can't be something you're trying to muscle and. Right. That's what I'm saying. But I always try to do. I always try to muscle stuff. Right. But even, even the fact that you're now going, this is what I do. The fact that you're articulating what it is that you do is not fixing that. No. It's not fixing it. The only way you fix it is to go and do it and to stop doing the thing that you're not supposed to do and start doing the thing that you are supposed to do and then do it consistently so that it becomes. Stop failing and start sports. Well, but they call it muscle memory, where your body is so used to doing the thing that it's like going up and down stairs. You don't think about it. In fact, it's even been explained that if you were to think about it, if you were to start thinking about the steps while you're going up and down the steps, you would not be able to do it. It starts with that premise. It talks about. You might have used the wrong example because Luke regularly falls down our stairs. Well, maybe something else, maybe it's not from overthinking. Trust me. It's just from being careless. It opens with the premise of the way that like an abasque ball game when somebody is just making everything that they throw up. They're talking about them playing out of their mind or they're unconscious out there. There's some truth to that statement is that if they were to start thinking about, oh, I'm on a hot streak, I got to keep this going. I got to keep doing what I've been doing. You start, they lose it. Right. Actually, if you're playing against somebody and they're just in that state, if you compliment them and tell them, oh, you're like, if you get them to think about it, they'll mess up. Yeah. And so it's about getting into those states more. Well, Sir Hall used to do that when we would be bowling and if I was doing well, he would go, do you start with your left foot or your right foot? That was it. All done. Yeah. So anyway, that's what it's about. It's about getting you to do that more, as we said. Well, the thing is, even so as he asked that question, then I started thinking, well, which do I lead with? And then, and then that was it. I was, I was so, the muscle memory was still there. I didn't, I wasn't even aware of which foot I started with until he asked that question. And then, right. And then that's what I was thinking about. I couldn't bowl with him. Your best friend messing you up that way. But Tim was always the natural athlete in our family. And I was always the reader. And it was just comical if Tim tried to explain to me how he did anything at all. And he would get frustrated and he'd be like, you just look so, you just look so awkward, you know, uncoordinated. He didn't know words like uncoordinated. But that's what he meant. And he'd be like, you just look dumb out there, Mandy. Yeah. And he'd be like, all right, well, then tell me then. And he's like, just do it. Just do it. And it's like, yeah, you, to me, anytime a really gifted athlete tries to then turn around and explain what they're doing, it's just they might as well not. But Well, they're trying to articulate muscle movement. They're trying to articulate reflexes and things that just happen. And I don't know why they happen. I don't know what reflexes are and what triggers your hand-eye coordination. I mean, it's an enormously complicated bio electrical process that gets you to catch a ball or throw a ball or hit a ball. And to try to break that down into a series of movements. So much of it is so much faster than you're able to talk to your body. Anyway, you can't have those thoughts. Right. Well, and it's all, it's a miracle. It's a miracle that we can walk. You know, it's a miracle that we can, that our hands, we can, we can send our hands at a target and our fingers can can pick things up and we can, we can write stuff. And all of that is just enormously complicated. And all the damage we did to our shoulders this afternoon is going to heal. It's going to be right back out there. But we do it with children. You know, we're trying to teach them the form letters, for example. You know, here's how you make an A. And you can tell them and you can show them, but until they actually practice forming those letters so that they know what it feels like to move their fingers in a way to do that, then they can't do it. You can, they can watch hours of video of people, you know, forming letters. Until you actually do it yourself, you can't, you can't learn it. Yep. So I'll, I'll maybe give another update once I finish the book and I'll tell you whether it, it's crap or it's, it's something you should consume. Oh, man. I just, I for one want to hear the update. I for one. Yeah. I would love to hear the second half of how to not think about stuff. Another. I'm not thinking about stuff right. I'm not thinking about other few chapters, but we really need in order to really stop thinking it's to read right now several more chapters of this guy's words and thoughts and explanations. That's what we need. We need more words in our head to know how to get thoughts out of our head. More words to put in our head that we can promptly as possible. He said he's aware of the irony. Mm-hmm. It's more than an irony. It's what's called self-contradictory. It's what's called, yes, inconsistent in the sense that like, once you're aware of it, it's the gospel at all times when necessary use words. It's like, it's always necessary there. You just used words right here. Yeah. Yeah. There's a difference between, oh, that's ironic and that's paradoxical. Like if it's something that is impossible to do both simultaneously, that's more than just a vague irony. That's like, it's a paradox. Yeah, that's like you trying to pull yourself up by your good strategy, whatever. Contradictory term, yeah. Well, you know, at some point though, we have to use words, right? You have to read, you have to read, you have to send instructions to other human beings. Yeah, there's, so, but you can't think their thoughts for them, right? I mean, you can say, well, this is what I do or this is the ritual that I perform or this is the mantra that I repeat or this is the, this is what I do. And then they're not going to understand until they try to do it. I've watched lots of videos. Some even instruction that would help you may not help me because we're not the same, we don't have the same learning styles as fairly in our bodies are, I mean, you're a right slash lefty depending on what you're doing. And I am definitely not. And so it's, Luke came up with something, I don't know, when he came up with it, but he shared it this week about how to help support Emory who often will take 10 or 15 minutes just to tie a pair of shoes because I don't know. I'm not Emory and I don't really think much like Emory does. Right. When you say, I need to put my shoes on, you just put your shoes on. Yeah, I go put my shoes on. Well, and no, the thing is I will get distracted. You put your shoes on because you're about to do something and you don't lose sight of the fact that it's about the thing you're about to do. You're incorrect. For Emory, putting shoes on is the thing and she's not thinking about what's next at all. I'm getting ready to describe that what I'm trying to help you understand though is that being normal is not what you think it is. I am not thinking about putting on the shoes so that I can go and do the next thing or whatever. I am usually thinking about 12 or 15 things simultaneously and I don't get lost in all of those things. I have multiple things in my mental to do list all the time and I can manage to keep track of them until we get to a certain number. We get to about eight of them then I actually have to start writing it on the fridge or I start to feel a little crazy. But also there's habits that we get in the mornings that you don't think about at all. Autopilot tells me that when my breath tastes bad it's time to brush my teeth because I do that every morning and brushing hairs and other ones and she packs her lunch every day and she has to eat cereal every day and she has to put her shoes on every day and she's got the same like 40 minutes to do it in. All before the same time every day. And if you send her off on the mission to go get the hairbrush there is no telling how long it's going to take her to come back with the hairbrush and occasionally she comes back with other stuff and not the hairbrush and it's just so anyway Luke's recommendation was to tell her to zoom out. Zoom out and most people would tell her to focus right and he would tell her to focus. I might yeah I would tell her to focus. Because you don't have our brain. Focus on the I guess I needed to be more specific on what I wanted her to focus on but yeah he's Luke's point is that she needs to stop focusing on the minutia and I would zoom out to the larger picture of putting her shoes on. What are we trying to do here? Yes. It's stop focusing on like wow this shoelace needs to be loosened slightly more. Luke's resolution feels it feels literally like a camera panning out and it's like oh you're you're back in reality where there's time and objectives and expectations and oh I was told something and zoom out. Right so she's too close. She's zoomed in on the tiny little right now to what extent is that same phenomenon going to happen to somebody who who processes similarly if you tell them you know just just get in the flow you know get in the flow and have muscle memory and go by instinct and practice your swing as if you're not judging like doing all of those things. To what extent is that going to help them or will it just put them even further into hyper focus on minutia and tiny little details that don't need to be analyzed. Do you see what I'm saying? I understand I understand the concern there. Yeah well I don't know. Would you recommend the book to Emory if there was a how to tie your shot of book for children? I mean the concept though. For children. He's not the book for children. Well it's interesting it's in a way you're sort of talking about priorities right? I mean if you're if you're priority the priority is what in the morning is to be ready to go to school like the the priority is that you get to school on time. And so if you lose track of that priority by and thinking about it as zooming in is I mean that's legitimate. You don't see the goal now anymore now you're looking at whatever it is that's caught your attention you know I've got to get my I've got to get the tongues of my shoes you know to match or something like that. Well it's like is there anything wrong with that? Well not necessarily but that's it's so unnecessary when the priority is to get ready to go to school on time. You know there's other things that need to be done. And so when I was diagnosed with ADHD so this would have been between 1st and 2nd grade and I was in the psychiatrist or whoever he was his office. One of the things that he recommended was that we play stickers around the house like on the bathroom here and everything that said stop think. And I had that similar to the concept. It's similar to the concept of help. I didn't do it until the morning of the next appointment so that I obviously had ADHD. I kind of told the man that's what's going to happen. Oh my gosh. It might have helped but I forgot to do it. You had any actual experience with children with any sort of specialty. It was basically a visual reminder of zoom out. I guess but it didn't work. It didn't work at all. I didn't do it. Right. Neither would Emory or anyone. And then actually they would have just become part of the environment and I wouldn't pay attention to them. Right. Well that was the thing that I discovered I forget. I was pretty young when somebody suggested you try a string or a finger to remember a thing and I'm like okay but then how do you remember what the string is for? You know because there were some of these people would have like three or four or five different strings around their fingers and it's like well now I'm not sure that that's Do these people live in reality? So the strings on this hand remind me of what the strings on this hand remind me. Right. By the time you get into all of that it's like well why don't you just remember the thing. So what extent is the purpose of struggling like this or is the real lesson does it come from trying to be part of the solution to the problem? Like to what extent do the children or any other human need to be involved in the solution? They have to be motivated to help find something that works for them which involves also asking certain questions about why do I do this? What am I thinking when I'm supposed to be thinking about something else? Why do I keep leaving my lunchbox at school? Why do I keep forgetting my homework at home? Why is that happening? What seems to help for me? Like I think a big part of the issue is when we try to treat people including ourselves sometimes like we are in these robots that we can program if we just you know who push some buttons or find the right drugs usually. But I think that the kids themselves need to be a made they need to be a made aware of the problem and instead of going out to find some expert who's basically like a body mechanic you know a human engineer who can crank the right dials and you know make the right suggestions. Like the kids themselves need to be involved with that whole process. They need to be shown. Here's what all the adults are talking about. We're all trying to find ways we can cut down on the morning routine so that we don't get frustrated with you first thing in the morning. Do you have any ideas? Well there was a conversation with your brother a couple of days ago short conversation about how his son is struggling in school. I had a conversation with my sister in law about their son. Right. He and Emory are very similar. Well like conversation with Tim was he goes you know I understand how Caden feels because I was the same way I hated school. I wasn't interested in it and I'm listening to him talk and basically make you know justifications and excuses. You know I feel I feel for him because I was the same way and it's like yeah I understand that to him. But and then but then Tim goes too far and says you know school just doesn't matter. I mean it's it's not like I mean what are you going to use it for and I said school does matter because school is is how it's how you begin to learn how to respect authority and to prioritize things and to and to follow through and do things that you aren't necessarily interested in. I mean there's so much beyond just the curriculum that you have to learn in school and if you don't learn it then you're just I'm you're crippled. I said it's so important that you as his father let him you can't let him get away with it and you certainly can't excuse it's like I understand school is stupid you know it's a I understand being bored you know you're right to be bored it's like you can't you can't do that it's you've got to focus not not because it's going to be super important that you remember what date the Battle of Gettysburg was fought but that you that you commit yourself to doing things that you don't necessarily want to do that you learn how to submit to authority that you learn how the world doesn't revolve around you that you learn that sometimes you're going to be bored and you have to you have to just be bored and follow through I mean there's so many things that you learn that are that are beyond the textbooks. Yep and at a Christian school you're also supposed to be learning how to integrate every part of your life with your Christian faith everything everything is spiritual everything is theology right and and young children aren't going to understand that and but the parents need to the parents need to understand that the this kid is going to fight and and complain and they're this is stupid what am I going to need this before and and it may be years before they understand it yeah and but it's important for for the parents to have the goal you know and the why in their mind is so that they can keep the kid from from failing yeah failing at life not necessarily keep them from failing that spelling test right because failure of spelling tests and failing of failing math papers and all of that that's part of the learning process as well well yes it's very important that we don't teach our kids to put things into tidy categories like well here's fun over here and there's work boring over there you know school is this very specific set of facts that's what school is and I never really enjoyed facts either like we don't want to agree with that interpretation of life because the truth is you are either learning things all the time for the rest of your life or you're not you're not able to learn things and if you are if you have this narrow definition of what learning is then yeah you're you're going to be limited you're crippled as you say there's there's a categorization that happens where people are they've compartmentalized artificially they've compartmentalized their lives and this starts in elementary school it starts in you know the public education system where you get up from one class you move over you go from math class over to history class you go from history class over to science and English from science to PE and oh everybody loves PE and lunch those are two very separate parts of the day um but you know your teachers from all of those other classes don't really communicate a ton with each other they're not really working together on the curriculum or um you know in in most situations it's very artificially separated as if your brain isn't going with you to every single one of those places and as if there isn't some form of soup being made in your you know in your conscious mind out of all of those things whether what you're learning is what's written on the board and what your teacher's talking about or whatever's happening socially with all of your classmates you're constantly taking on information and it's being mixed up inside your head um and that's an education you're being taught something the question is what are you being taught are you being taught that there's a purpose in an order and a reason for everything are you being taught that there's a big bulk of your life that has no reason to it and does it you're never going to use again and it's not and that is called school right that's the idea is just to plow through just get it over with get it over with get passing get passing grades yeah you don't have to excel but just get passing grades and I wonder is quickly as possible I wonder to what extent this backward understanding of education might might contribute to something like what Mike Winger exposed about Cheon the prophet this week did you finish that movie that video you were watching then did you watch the whole I didn't watch the whole thing but I made it through much did you get through I made it through I don't know half maybe there's no reason for me to talk about the whole thing there's just one particular part that really struck me I just was flabbergasted not now that's not even the right word I'm not even surprised I was flamuck unfortunately not as befuddled surprised as I would have been a few years ago but shocked apparently according to Mike Winger he gave Cheon an opportunity to meet with him over like zoom and Cheon did he went there he went and it was a face to face yeah and and Mike took a witness and Cheon took a witness so there were four people in this room and he did not Che did not want to record it so it is not on record but both the witnesses were taking their own notes about what happened I find that interesting too and I haven't even really had the chance to unpack it we don't want to have an actual word for word recording but both of our witnesses are going to take notes right as if the people who are listening are going to do a better job of actually accurately recording what went on then the electronic weird thing in the world to not have a conversation recorded but isn't weird if you process things in the way that I'm describing which is crippled and and backward way of doing it why would I don't mind having people record stuff I mean we record we record per conversation every week and put them out there so the the part that I recorded for you guys I put it in a text message as soon as I heard it and was like this is just interesting to me was at one point back in like 2018 or something like that Cheon was made aware of all the allegations against Sean Bulls there was a lot of concerning stuff from multiple witnesses saying he was kind of a creep behind closed doors in the hotel rooms and stuff and so it was to the extent that Bethel decided to break ties with him officially like they stopped platforming him but nobody ever made the public aware that he was a dangerous guy and so this was this was all happening in like the 20 teens right and then in 2022 Cheon endorsed Sean Bulls' book that was published in 2022 and so Mike Winger asks him about this and he says to him in your endorsement you said well first of all Cheon basically says I never endorsed him which is crazy talk because of course you did it's on Sean's so Mike read him the endorsement so Mike reads him the endorsement it says this is a this is one of my good friends and you know you're gonna there's no I don't remember word for word but basically there's no more you know there's no better prophetic voice than Sean Bulls he's got such an anointed voice or whatever they say but he called him a good friend that part I have down because Mike said to him you said Sean was your good friend was he your good friend was your good friend well because the question now has a different in you know implication to say that you've been outed and completely he's trying Che is trying to say he really wasn't that close to him he didn't have any authority over him it wasn't his responsibility to hold him accountable is what he's trying to say now so when Mike says were you a good friend with Sean Che says no right I wasn't and so and Mike says okay well why did you say you were good friends in this endorsement right and Che near as I can tell had no idea where this line of questioning was going to actually go right he goes well I was trying to be loving right trying to say positive uplifting and encouraging things about Sean right and so Mike says at this point he was trying to just get everything out on the table and clarify what he had already admitted like as far as he was concerned Che just admitted that he was dishonest and he goes so Mike goes so you tried to be loving by lying to people in your endorsement he said I didn't lie and Che said I didn't lie no I never lied right and it's just after he just said that he said he was a good friend yeah but he really wasn't a good friend right but I didn't lie right it's like it's like you're talking to somebody who's slow or like there's something missing in their brain it's like what is actually wrong with you it's like the thoughts don't stack on top of each other they don't they don't connect to each other it's like every every statement is independent of every other statement yeah well it reminds me of wither it reminds me of wither from that hideous strength where he just talks and if you're trying to make sense of it you're gonna go crazy you're gonna be the one going crazy because it'll be like oh it's very simple we would love to have you on board you just have to remember two things don't do stuff and also don't be caught not doing stuff right and that's literally what he says literally what he says and and if you pretend like if you ask for clarification beyond that he'll start to get visibly annoyed with you right and it's like but you're the one contradicting yourself it's it's bizarre like I say flabbergasting mind blowing but literally you said you were good friends are you good friends were you good friends no so you lied to people no I never lied right and when I was I did make it through that part and I was I was thinking as as Michael's revealing what happened it would not have been a problem for Chey to say yeah he was a good friend um that doesn't necessarily reflect badly on it doesn't reflect badly on a person to be friends with somebody who turns out to be uh you know granted Sean did some stuff if it's if it's true and apparently it is yeah he's he's like a criminal but there is to be a friend with somebody is is not anything you necessarily have to be ashamed of um what what is problematic is saying that you're a friend with a person while you're endorsing their book and then when it comes out later that he's you know he's this bad guy uh and then you go ahead and endorse the book after that you know right is well now you're being dishonest you're being you're you're being disingenuous right but if you're if you're friends with a person and that person commits a crime that doesn't alter the fact that you were friends with that person or it shouldn't but I don't think that's the issue when you try to go and do damage control after the fact I don't I'm afraid it's just going to make me look bad no I think you've got this twisted I don't think that Cheyenne was ever friends with anyone I don't think anybody in the charismatic leadership is capable of true friendship I think they use the word friend for political and marketing promotional purposes only I don't think they know what the definition of a friend is the same way we have had interactions with people in churches who use the word family oh he's a brother in Christ where family they do not know the meaning of that word and so yeah when they use it there are certain people out there in the congregation who are going to be moved by it and they'll keep bringing it up later he said he was he said he saw me as like a daughter he said that he always saw himself as a father figure in my life and now he hasn't even contacted me in the last six months he just said that for the effect yeah he said that because he knew that that would make you feel good yep and so here's the thing so people were down in Mike's comment thread saying things like well all right anytime you see a book endorsed by Cheyenne you know that it's rubbish you can't trust a word that comes out of his mouth he just says whatever he thinks it's going to take to sell books I promise you though if Chey himself were to read that from people he would feel very very misbreeded and yeah he would feel very sorry for himself because people just don't understand I was trying to be loving towards Sean right by saying whatever felt right and good it's it's possible that he doesn't even know what loving is either no he definitely doesn't I believe him when I believe that when he said I was trying to be loving he meant he was trying to say words that sound loving I believe that he's a pastor uh-huh he's a prophet a prophet or a apostle in the he's a big time pastor he's got a gigantic congregate which is why his name was wanted for the book right because it's put on Sean Bulls's website and people are like wow that's that's a big deal he's like he's up there with Chris Valatin from Bethel and um Jonathan Bill Johnson from Bethel so kind of along the same lines uh I ran across a segment from Pat Noswald um I haven't seen this I heard it did you send that to Pete like I'm going to I'm going to forget but the uh the just of it is this is Pat Noswald from his who's super woke not a Christian not a not a person that I'm going to recommend that you go and look up Carl you can't even watch this clip you may know who he is already I'm Pat Noswald has been he was in Stranger Things uh he was Bob the Compan Stranger Things recently but he's been in several movies and um he kind I get him confused with the hobbit all the time he's not Samwise gang he's not Samwise he's not Sean Aston but he looks like him doesn't he sort of same shape he's got the same head shape if you put them up next to each other you can tell which one is older it's Ross Sean Aston with the old man from up like no you mean Pat Noswald yeah no if you cross you cross Sean Aston with the old man from up then you get Patten they come out they've got like square heads yeah he does he's he's very blocky he's very blocky so if you cross Sean Aston with Steve from Minecraft yeah that's a dead ringer right there in my head all right if you know if you don't know who Pat Noswald is now you know fix Sean Aston you don't need to look just picture him merged with something square up yeah with a box with you know like a like a box that a copier would come in like cereal like Cocoa pops like a giant great of Cocoa Puffs and Sean Aston um man anyway so uh Pat Noswald is a is a staunch liberal progressive and so his his standup has a little segment in there and he says you know what doesn't age well is being woke now Pat Noswald is is the wokeest of the woke yeah and and he even says that he goes no I'm woke you know so he's so he's making sure that everybody understands he's got his woke bonafights he goes but uh but the thing is that once you uh you know even when I'm 70 you know I'm gonna say something you know that's not going to be woke at the time I'm gonna I'm gonna go back on you know I'm gonna say something about and here's the thing wokeism is always about it's always about sex like the like the all of the progressive stuff that when they when they talk about some something is going to do he's he's dirty so I won't be able to repeat what he was saying but his his illustration that he used was about some sort of weird sexual thing um and people are gonna go well he he goes you shouldn't be a like I'm gonna say something like uh you shouldn't you shouldn't sleep with your clone is how you know that's not the way you put it but you shouldn't sleep with your clone and people are going to stop clone hate you know now the thing is he's right he's right that that if no matter no matter where you draw the line the progressives are always going to accuse you of being oppressive and backwards and uh trying to control them and and so on so it doesn't matter where you draw the line so he's correct the only thing that you can do to be progressive is to draw no lines if you if you say there anything is incorrect or shouldn't be done then you will be you will be tasteless you will be you will be crucified he's correct about all of that um but even as he's saying that it doesn't occur to him which is what we're talking about oh my gosh why why am I progressive why why am I why is it so important to me that these people recognize that I too am woke you know because I'm telling you what our fate is going to be we are we are I'm the king of woke I'm the I'm the prince of woke but I know that eventually um I'm not going to be woke enough eventually eventually things are going to slide to a point where I'm not going to be able to go there anymore and I will become a pariah they will I will be hated I will become the villain so he knows that and still he is uh he's on that path he won't he won't step off so uh I just thought that it it was super interesting to me to hear a guy who who's who has figured it out and it hasn't changed him he hasn't well because because if he's a full blown neilist and he just genuinely thinks that's the way the world is then then yeah he doesn't he's not gonna go wow I don't like the end result I don't like the conclusion of my worldview therefore I'm going to change the worldview if he's convinced that the lens is he's wearing or the correct prescription then even though he doesn't like what he's seeing through them he's not gonna take them off he just thinks that that's how it is he thinks that people just need to accept that the only thing the only question I would have is why doesn't he just say anything goes he doesn't he doesn't have a basis for not saying that why doesn't he just say hey officially guys my official statement is whatever y'all are tolerating and it you know promote actively promoting in the next in the future whatever you guys are promoting just assume that I would be for it but he can't because because that would include things like Christianity that would include uh you know Christian camps and it would include why can't he say that why can't he say whatever whatever you think whatever happens to be the trendy thing in another century two centuries five centuries just assume I'd be on board with it because I am so woke and so open-minded I will literally go anywhere that the majority because that would immediately today before he before he's dead and gone that would get make him a pariah if he was to say you know what the the the mega people are you know good good on them good on them for being mega good on them for voting for Trump because that's not the current that's not the current trend it's but that's anything goes if you're going to say anything goes to that include that mega anything you're making the assumption that that culture is all going in the same direction there's so much infighting even within the pagans that you can't be like like is John you can't say everything is sure that's what patnis figured out he's figured out that no matter no matter where he draws the line he is going to run a foul of his woke brethren which which was the character in that hideous strength who who is it a filistrado or whatever who was it who like also had figured it out but he also had multiple backup plans he's like if things go under with this college I'll just go to the college up the street I already have a game plan for that too that's what I'm asking I don't understand why patent doesn't just say hey whatever you're mad about consider me a blank slate I will be your mascot I do not care what you are what you're doing who you are and what you're saying whatever it is whatever it is that you decide to do in the future just consider me one of your people too I'm on board with that that's a that's a comedian's bit that I just sold is it yeah there you go he's like I'm basically whatever y'all are yeah and then little bit lady goes I got vaccinated unless you didn't yeah right yes yes this is so good to say it is exactly that what do you do you just laugh to why because it's obvious that you're pandering it's obvious that you're a that nobody has respect for that nobody has respect for blank slate not yet maybe in the future they will maybe in another hundred and fifty years that's going to be the thing that everybody wants to be it's because that's that is what people are effectively being turned into through their education if we can call everybody's a blank slate who who draws on them oh good question what's the answer in that hideous drink there isn't anybody yeah that's eventually what happens is they just they destroy themselves who is calling the shots though who was who was behind who was actually pulling the strings it wasn't the guys hook in the head up to the lungs no it wasn't withers it was uh it wasn't a person it wasn't an actual human being it was creatures invisible creatures beings far beyond the earth's uh what far beyond what we can see here on earth and there so there's demigods or what they're really angels but they're spiritual beings and then there's the biggest of all the biggest spiritual being of all who's behind the good guys I didn't think you believed in centralized organized eat not on you not on humans there is no centralized human villain the only antithesis and I'm glad you breathed up the only antithesis that actually matters is the one between God and his enemies that's it there's God and his be his angelic beings and there's Satan and his beings right right well and humans are are playing along were players who are going to be on one side or the other when I that's what I think I think the woke people like pat noss walt I mean they they believe themselves to be very enlightened and and advanced they that's what the term progressive means they're out in front they are right they're more evolved right certainly than us backwards Christians um but it's they're they're deceived I mean they just don't see it even while they're articulating their future they're march right into it they don't they and and they're inconsistent because I would agree you know they're they're they're going to say well you know it's not our it's not our call we don't want to control people's lives we people should be free people should be able to do what they think is the right thing to do but they don't believe that when when you say well yeah then we should you know we should take our kids to church and teach them to sing Sunday school song tunes and all that that they're not on board with that and so even as they're even as they're recognizing the uh the inconsistency that they're living and the fact that they're that their open mind is this is never going to be enough that they they they understand that the next generation the generation is coming up is going to hate them it's going to look back at them as as backwards and regressive and hateful and bigoted and stupid why because that's how they look at their ancestors right they look back at their ancestors and think that they were a bunch of backwards uh hateful bigoted clothes-minded um-hum imbisels and so anybody this halfway uh woke I guess she is going to know that that's what's that's what's going to patent has figured out he is going to be he is not going to be a hero he's going to be right he's going to be a villain right but I still don't necessarily think that the obvious and natural alternative to that would be to become a Christian I don't think that that's the next step from there I I think that if you I think there's a way that you can just accept like the guy who committed suicide at the end of that hideous strength I genuinely totally believe that that's why you would commit suicide because you're because there's nothing else to do that's not why he committed suicide his get his gig was up his his head was severed the guy of the uh all the work he thought he was doing was gone he decided he was going to live out the fact that it was just a chemical it was just a chemical in his head and so anything that would have stopped him from harming himself was finally taken away it was you know anything in his head that would have said you shouldn't do this or it's wrong or it's going to hurt you know any fear any pain was eventually transcended because he just genuinely did internalize the idea that it was just matter it was just matter and so he's like it's fine uh just I know what's really happening here I know what's I'm really I'm on the inside here with the knowledge I know that this is just biology more enlightened it's just biology and so there's nothing really to be afraid of there is no such thing as fear the thing that we normally call fear is just a chemical and the thing we normally call heroism is just sort of a positive feeling people have for other people but it's just chemicals and so he didn't really figure out I don't think patnis that I don't think patnis that enlightened I don't think he believes in truth I think he believes in truth I think he I think he believes that there is I think he believes that being woke is correct I think he believes that that is the moral position that you're supposed to have I think he's a nealist but he is but he is starting to see that yeah that it's uh that that it's uh what's the word I'm looking for it's it's not fixed it's it's going to be it's he's in a slide and he's and he's calling it progressive that's that that's the thing he doesn't call it degradation you know he doesn't call it de-evolution he calls it progressive he thinks he thinks he's moving forward but but he's not he's sliding into the abyss they all are and they're going into into oblivion and uh and he I whether he's blind to that or whether he doesn't want to admit it or whatever totally blind doesn't have any idea what he's saying it's all disconnected thoughts he's being darkened he's darkened by the uh by the enemy he doesn't have the grace from God necessary to feel bad about himself yeah so he's a comedian so there's already something something's wrong with him already we should look him up it says to his picture look up that in Oswald make sure that you remember Sean Aston and and the refrigerator box and what's that what's the name oh get uh Steve no no no the guy from up oh ed asner what ed asner it does look like him yeah anyway look up thanks for visiting the comedian's house if you want to spend more time with our family you can follow john brainyan on youtube and facebook also email next door at johnbrainyan.com with your comments and questions we'll see you next time